Take 'Em to Task: Occupy Obama

[Smiley and West]

		A listener from Occupy Seattle takes West to task about his openness to voting for Barack Obama in this year’s election. Read Mark Taylor-Canfield’s Open Letter to Dr. Cornel West, originally published on dailykos.com. Occupy Seattle website

[Jon Raymond]

Kris, I think it's people like you who make society work, not government. It's time to revamp government and remove money, remove top down organizational structure, and install resourced based systems and consensus by all, without leaders. People and groups can be autonomous to lead and take action in specific areas. But the idea of a president of the entire country or representatives of millions no longer works. Our political system elects people based on charisma and star power, not integrity, not honor, not ability to work for all the people.

I look forward to watching Thrive. By the way, I am also a filmmaker and have a documentary about healthcare you may find interesting. I am in the process of getting it distributed. It has limited availability for now. The website is http://gothealthcaremovie.com

 

[Jeff 4 Justice]

I'll vote for Roseanne before I vote for Obama now that she's running for President.

Max Keiser Roseanne Barr Discuss "Occupy Wall Street", and Bank$ters

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DhzQl2YeOBc

[Jacquelyn N'Jai]

I think it is dangerous to tell someone not to vote for someone. It is a personal preference. We are trying to get people to vote. Unless you have an alternative to Obama, I hope others follow their own instincts, reasoning, etc. If we let others vote for us why vote?

[Jon Raymond]

Dr. West fears a right wing take over and so he's not voting for a Republican. I don't think it matters. The right is so screwed up and can't agree among themselves. If they takes things over they'll likely shoot themselves in the foot and possibly implode the party. No doubt they evoke an uprising in this country os unknown proportions and president.

I think it is in-genuine, dishonorable, and lacks integrity to vote for someone because they are the best of two evils. I voted for Obama and he has taken away numerous rights of Americans including due process. He sold out health care to the insurance industry. You cannot take pictures on the streets of America without being subject to arrest thanks to Mr. President. He is backed by Wall Street and will always cave to their wants and greed. 45,000 Americans die annually for lack of healt6h care and Obama's plan simply gave the insurance industry more control and mandated private coverage. This equates to killing Americans who can't afford to pay Wall Street to stay alive.

I am not going to vote again for Obama or anyone and live with the fact that people's deaths are on my head. No. Its time to stand up and revolt against this system that has ruled over us like feudal lords. I will not vote, ever, again. Democracy no longer exists. Our votes mean nothing. As far as I am concerned America is over. If you want to vote for Obama to continue to kill 45,000 Americans annually, let it be on your head.

[Denise Harris]

There is no competition regarding who to vote for this November. This country simply can not allow a right wing takeover. That would be the end of democracy! No protest or occupy or boycott could move the rightwing to flinch in support of the 99%. At least the left include bleeding hearts with emphathy.

[Maggie Meehan]

I read with empathy both Denise Harris and Jon Raymond.  Earlier in the discussion one writer suggested the voting decision could best be made closer to the November general election and I agree.  Meantime there are voting options other than the two major parties and I hope to be able to vote Green.  If there is a major gap between the two parties in WV where I live, I will definitely vote Green, write in, if necessary. 

Jon, I have had the opinion for a long time that folks who don't go to the polls don't have a right to argue about politics with much credibility and I still feel that way.

Denise,  I have voted Democratic for years, and worked hard in several states, and I was really pleased to see Obama elected, but I am disappointed in many things he has done and not done.  I am starting to believe that we don't have to have both houses of Congress and the White House all in the same party's hand.  Possibly with a multiparty mix we would see better cooperation.

However it goes, keep the faith, speak up, and vote.

Denise Harris said:

There is no competition regarding who to vote for this November. This country simply can not allow a right wing takeover. That would be the end of democracy! No protest or occupy or boycott could move the rightwing to flinch in support of the 99%. At least the left include bleeding hearts with emphathy.

[Jon Raymond]

Maggie, your opinion that people that don't vote don't have a right to credibly argue is quite totalitarian. You don't have the right to tell anyone what their rights are; nor to judge their credibility. Where in the Constitution does it say you have to vote to argue politics. Correct me if I'm wrong, but he Constitution does not even specify that we have political parties, nor elections. It is therefore quite credible to argue that voting is questionable. The constitution doesn't even mention it. The decision to vote or not IS politics.

What about the disenfranchised? Do they also loose rights to argue politics? The current US government effectively disenfranchises all of us with voting fraud, the electoral college, lack of choice, and a government run by money. We have the right to argue against anything we want to, including the very existence of Congress and the very structure of government. That right is called free speech. Nowhere in the First Amendment does it say you have to vote to have these rights. You have them. Period. You, on the other hand, have no right to limit mine. Get an education.

Here is your government. Do you really believe that a vote will change this? If so tell it to Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny.

[Ricardo Jones]

To all we now know and have seen that obama is as corrupt as bush. If the president had both houses of congress he would still be corrupt. obama is a Daly man from the start to the finish. Please don't vote for obama based on the color of his skin and his education. His programs have no substance. The president is only going to feed the elitist corrupt government he and daly appointed. The president has the power to Veto and executive orders. Please stop making excuses for the president.

[Ricardo Jones]

We all must vote. Jon if you don't vote then the elitist who have highjacked our democratic republic win. We must understand that our democracy has been taken over by the ruling class elitist. Corruption and greed rule the day in this and other adminstrations. Working Class good salt of the earth Americans have no voice in this government. Fear and intimidation controls the government and this country. Change the president this november to send a clear message to all corrupt politicians. We want LEADERS not corrupt POLITICIANS NOW.   

[Mark Taylor-Canfield]

I would vote for political candidates who embrace the following goals (which are, by the way, the issues that the Occupy Wall Street movement are trying to address):

1)  Efforts to stop home foreclosures

2)  Ending the massive outsourcing of US jobs

3)  Reversing the deterioration of our industrial infrastructure

4)  Stopping the government bail outs of major corporate interests

5)  Withdrawal of US troops from foreign military conflicts

6)  Major tax reforms including closure of loopholes for corporations and the wealthiest members of society

7)  Campaign finance reforms – (getting big money out of politics)

8)  Investment in local economies – (including investment of public money in local community and publicly owned state banks and credit unions)

9)  Tax breaks and economic relief for the middle class and unemployed

10) Accessible and affordable healthcare and education for all

11) Financial reforms and public accountability on Wall Street

12) Protection of our fundamental constitutional rights and individual liberties

13) Energy independence from fossil fuels including middle-eastern oil reserves

14) Economic opportunity for all Americans

[Jon Raymond]

Mark,

no such candidate exists nor could they exist within this government; nor if they did, could they accomplish any of this in the least. Wall Street owns the government on every level. The only way to get there is outside the government. Occupy is anarchy and outside the government. That's the only reason why it works.

Ricardo,

They already won. Obama is Bush, but worse because people are complacent in believing he isn't. War has escalated more under Obama than Bush. Rights have been taken away under him. You can now be arrested on any street in America simply for taking pictures and without due process, thrown in jail. You want leaders? Change the President to WHAT? Obama has already won. Your vote doesn't count. No third party has ever had a chance in hell of winning. What makes this election different?

Your rights are gone. Democracy is dead. Capitalism is corporatism. America isn't a fairy tale where the good guy rides in with the cavalry to save the day. America is dying a slow death. Open up your eyes. Election after election we see this. Decade after decade. More war. More corporatism. More greed.

There is no answer that includes an elected leader of this decayed government. The one ray of hope is Occupy with its alternative to government. It is autonomous and has already worked to prove people don't need government to live. It does not matter who wins this election. Nothing will change except your perception of reality fed to you through the corporate media.

To concern yourself with voting is to subvert your energy to the dark side of decision for the worst of evils. It is self destructive, self denial, insincere, and drains all your integrity. Do you honestly feel good about voting? You are given no choice. But you'll never get it until it hits home one day when its too late. We are headed down a road that will make Nazism look like recess in Kindergarten.

What if they gave a war and no one showed up? What if they had an election an no one voted? Just imagine the impact of that for a moment. imagine. By voting we approve of the system. By not voting we make it known we don't. When you vote for something you know is a false hope, you deny your own existence. You proclaim yourself as worthless.

[Mark Taylor-Canfield]

I'm considering submitting a resolution to the local Democrats demanding that they endorse the goals I listed in my last post. Just curious how they would respond.

Only thing is, even if they are willing to endorse the Occupy Wall Street movement and its goals, I have very little faith in either their commitment or their ability to actively support any of these causes once they get elected...