Take ‘Em to Task

[Smiley and West]

		A listener from Chicago takes Smiley to task for his comments about education.

[DollarMonopoly.com]

Both sectors have flaws.  The primary flaw of the public sector is bureaucracy.  One of the ways to remedy bureaucracy is firing non-performers.  If you notice every time we have an exchange I keep coming back to the same point.  The process of rebuilding starts with removing incompetence.  That goes for the people at the top, the bottom, and everything in between.   What shape and form the cleansing process comes in is a delicate process that needs to be well thought out but it's obvious you and I don't see eye to eye on this point but maybe in the future just entertain the idea.

[Wilma de Soto]

The private sector is where you should stay. Your work is judged as your work. Others' work is NOT judged as your work. When all things point to you, it is easier to hold one accountable and your competence on incompetence is evident.

In a public school classroom it is not so easy. Being held accountable based on the work other people do and with people who are not fully formed, with adult thinking and judgment and discernment is even more tenuous.

I know people in the private sector think these principals can be applied to public school children and their teachers, which show incredible ignorance.

Let's say you are hungry and go to a restaurant. The food is prepped for you, seasoned for you, cooked for you and served to you.  But after all that, you don't eat it. 

Now you want to close the restaurant and fire the staff because you left the restaurant hungry. This is the private sector's answer to weeding out ineffective teachers. There may have been a three Michelin Star chef in that kitchen, but if you don't eat the food, it's HIS fault.

What's good for the private sector does not necessarily transfer to public school education. What adults can handle is not necessarily good for children.

[DollarMonopoly.com]

obviously nothing i have said will cause you to reconsider.  your so firm in your beliefs that it baffles me why you just can't entertain the idea.  anyway, we can just agree to disagree. luckily i don't have to seek compromise with what i do. i would probably lose it if i did.

[Wilma de Soto]

I suppose the same can be said for you.  The research I have provided, the examples everything I have tried to put forth in this discussion in response to the points you have made have not been considered by you. I have entertained your points and responded as to why I feel they are not feasible when it comes to public schools.

Weeding out bad teachers is not a problem for me, as I have said before.  Using test scores of children is not the way to do it unless teachers are taking the tests themselves.

As a teacher, I am not a part of the bureaucracy. If you believe that teachers are a part of the bureaucracy, you are in error.  Teachers work hard. Bureaucrats do not.

[DollarMonopoly.com]

I'll drink to that!

[Wilma de Soto]

LOL!

[George Scruggs]

I agree about the notion of a bill that provide a good education for all children.  However such a bill may enclude longer hours of school and I'm fine with that but the people who would call for such a bill would have to be ready to support the changes it would bring about.  I don't agree that our community dosen't care about education!  Those who care aren't given the same forums as the examples of those who don't.  We are one of the few races that are judged by the worse it produces while most everyone else is judged by the best it produces.  I agree there has to be an attitude adjustment in our culture but there is an need for that adjustment across the board.  I have tried to be a good dad and a good enfluence to others but I can't take the credit for anyone else's sucess no more than I can take the blame for anyone else's failures.  Let's give the positive more press.  Kids aspire to what is loved or respected and in most cases what is given attention too.  Let's give more to those who strive against the odds to be a productive part of society and have a harder road to go.  I know a young lady that just graduated from CSU and has a bright future but you wouldn't know that by the enfluences around her.  She made a decision to do better and be her best so the idea that a child can only perpetuate that which is around him or her is silly and relieves society of it's responsibility to help produce the best person possible out of all our children.

[JamieLMyer]

I agree with you, Mr. Scruggs.  I wonder if the young lady you mentioned had a significant influence in her life that showed her the possibilities she is capable of?  A mentor, a favorite teacher, aunt, uncle???  A few years ago I had to research and write a paper on women who are able to extricate themselves from cyclical poverty, dysfunctional families, etc.  across the board the word that kept coming up was resilience.  How do we teach that?  

 

As for "our community not caring," I think often, if someone hasn't had success in the public school system knowing what to demand for your children can be intimidating and hard.  How do we work together as a team with mutual respect for each other and our children enabling the best education possible.  Whenever a parent is losing their mind on me...I take a deep breath and tell them we are a team, not in opposition, but in collaboration working toward the best interest of their child.  Do you know how many parents have always heard just the negative and never, never anything positive...

[Wilma de Soto]

"I agree about the notion of a bill that provide a good education for all children."

We already have one. It's called Brown vs. Board of Education of Kansas City 1954 overturning Plessy vs. Ferguson saying that Separate but Equal was against the Constitution.

George Scruggs said:

I agree about the notion of a bill that provide a good education for all children.  However such a bill may enclude longer hours of school and I'm fine with that but the people who would call for such a bill would have to be ready to support the changes it would bring about.  I don't agree that our community dosen't care about education!  Those who care aren't given the same forums as the examples of those who don't.  We are one of the few races that are judged by the worse it produces while most everyone else is judged by the best it produces.  I agree there has to be an attitude adjustment in our culture but there is an need for that adjustment across the board.  I have tried to be a good dad and a good enfluence to others but I can't take the credit for anyone else's sucess no more than I can take the blame for anyone else's failures.  Let's give the positive more press.  Kids aspire to what is loved or respected and in most cases what is given attention too.  Let's give more to those who strive against the odds to be a productive part of society and have a harder road to go.  I know a young lady that just graduated from CSU and has a bright future but you wouldn't know that by the enfluences around her.  She made a decision to do better and be her best so the idea that a child can only perpetuate that which is around him or her is silly and relieves society of it's responsibility to help produce the best person possible out of all our children.

[Wilma de Soto]

@JamieLMyer: I must ask where you taught where your administrators were not good.

[George Scruggs]

Shame on you.  Brown v.s. The Board of Education hasn't gauranteed any child that the school they will attend will have the curriculum, supplies, and instruction they will need in order to proceed to the next level in their education and be on track with their conterparts.  I've worked in schools so this isn't coming out of a vacuum.  I love teachers and think they should be among the highest paid in the work force however I know of poor teachers as well as great teachers and there are problems in the classroom.  I know that teachers and administrations have burdens that hamper the mission of teaching.  But all too often these burdens have given way to an attitude of if they don't care why should I.  Everyone can't teach and that's why I have so much respect for good teachers.  The point is there is a shared blame when it comes to the failure of our schools.  I've had great administrators and poor administrators and even as a child I knew the difference, but I was taught to look at the entire picture and check myself first but don't be afraid to acknowledge problems.  If what I said dosen't exist where you are count yourself blessed or blind.  There are school districts that are the top of the charts and then there are districts that are flat out bad.  Better training, smaller classrooms, better equipment, more accountability for the student, etc.  I can't buy this notion of the problem being the communitys' or just parenting alone.  We need to get in where we fit in.  Lastly give more credit to those students who have achieved greatness and those teachers and administrators that perpetuate it.  

 

 

[DollarMonopoly.com]

Like your eluding too, tackling a complex problem like education requires taking both a top down approach and bottom up approach.  Well, given how big the problem is, education probably needs a top, bottom, sideways, upside-down, insideout approach.